FW: Yeast and lactobacillus - mba

21 Dec 2004

Steve, Steve, and Mike,
Thanks.  The link SF provided is more than I need for a Red, but I'm
actually leaning toward the Oud Bruin.  I found this link but it's more
about flavor than brewing.
http://www.northamericanbrewers.org/that_old_brown_magic.htm
I don't see Bret mentioned in the BJCP guidelines for an OB.  So, I would
avoid the Roselare since it includes the B word.  I'm looking for a balanced
beer. It appears that alcohol inhibits the lactic along with low temps, so
pitching all at once with a warmer ferment, rather than adding Lactic at
secondary seems the way to go, along with extended aging.
Mike
...
  From: Steve Fletty [mailto:fletty@umn.edu]
  3763 Roeselare Belgian Blend. This culture is a blend of Saccharomyces,
 Brettanomyces, and Lactic Acid Bacteria to produce classic
 Belgian styles of
 sour brown and red beers. The culture is maintained in equilibrium to
 produce a balanced beer with complex aromas and flavors. No
 additional yeast
 is necessary for primary fermentation.
 Also, this link:
 http://www2.parc.com/eml/members/apte/flemishredale.shtml 
...
 Steve Piatz agrees.
Wyeast Roselare is the one to use for Flanders Red as it is the proper
mixed culture.  From what I read it wants to ferment warm (over 75F
perhaps into the 80s) to get the sourness.  The lacto doesn't grow
very well at cool temps.  I held mine around 75-85 for a few months. 
Mike Valentiner takes the sour mash approach.
...
 We soured the mash at 115F for 36 hours, then conducted
the mash as usual. Results
...
 were satisfactory, but I was looking for more sourness.
A lot of work,
but I'm glad we tried the traditional method.  Once. 
...
 I'm thinking of making a soured stout, by pitching
Wyeast 4335
(L.delbrueckii) and letting it have its way with they wort for 3 days
(or so), then pitching S.cerevisiae.  The idea is the 3 days for the
L.delbruekii give it a chance to get established and produce a
significant degree of sourness.  The S.cerevisiae then takes over and
makes beer.  I forget why I decided three days. 